Keisler 5 speed conversion

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road chicken
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Keisler 5 speed conversion

Post by road chicken » Sun Jun 05, 2005 2:17 am

Ok troops,


About 6 weeks ago- I order the Keisler 5 speed conversion for the Road Chicken-( so of course the vaccuum motor on the Air Grabber finally puked-crap!!!) ANYWAY...This had been planned because I drive the car alot- especially on the highway. The big descision was "BOLT IN" with no cutting of the cross member or body needed.

Well it arrived yesterday- well part of it. The trans and accessories box. That included the Bell housing and the related hardware for installation.

Well it took all of 5 seconds to realize Keisler can't read-

1) The tranny was the wrong one- specifically the shifter is in the the wrong location-presumable because the part number shipped is the wrong one. Now keep in mind this trans was spcifically built for my order. But had my name listed on it. There was also a suspiciuos looking piece of metal in the box also- but more on that in a minute.

2) one bolt pack was missing in the acc. The mounting for the trans. Everything was in there.


3) Well now I'm slightly agitated. This is too stupid of a mistake to be accident-evidently readingisn't part of the deal here. Evidently the people packing the shipment can't take the time to read the frickin order list and see the trans is wrong- lets see what else the screwed up.
I open up the instruction packet and I find out what that 18"X18" piece of sheet metal is for. The want you cut a hole in the passenger side of the tunnel!!!!! SAY IT AIN"T SO BUNKY!!! WTF- I read the site over thoughly and no mention of that anywhere for the 4 speeds. there is one statement in the 71-74 specific section that some cars may need floorpan modification- SOME cars. Well I can certainly understand that on an Auto to Manual conversion- but on a 4-5speed conversion?!? Let me see- Auto needs floor pan cut- 4-5 speed needs the floor cut- just what other cars are there out there- SOME cars-evidently that is ALL cars jagoff!!!

4) NOPE Not done yet- Now here is the kicker for me. The drive shafi- er Shaft. They want to you to tear your car down-install the trans- then make a measurement from the center of the rearend u-joint to the back of their trans. Call that measurment in then the will get you a driveshaft made and shipped. I'm sorry but where I'm at now- that is not an option. I can't do anywork here- and while I do have access to a fullblown garage- I can't leave the car sitting there for a week or two while thet get a shaft built and shipped. Hell from the trans I'd probably wind up with something for a GM. Now how many driveshaft lengths were there 2-maybe 3?? Each one specific to auto or manual on a 71-4 B body.

Can you tell I'm a bit beside myself. I worked as a Engineering tech for some 21 years. I built prototypes for some of the wildest cutting edge technology that has been seen- ( Next time you see the SEAWOLF sub- and touch screens -your seeing my handywork.). Well I guess I have a different idea of PROPERLY researched and designed applications.

OK, Thats for letting me blow some steam here. Can't wait for the Customer service rep to call back. I sent him a call on wednesday-since I didn't here from him- an e-mail on Friday.

I swear to the Good LORD above this guy is gonna think he called Satans bitchy exwife with a serious case of PMS if they say I have to cut the floor pan- and can't come up with a driveshaft length from all their "Through Research". :mad: :mad: :rant: :rant: :mad: :rant:
4th generation B bodys- there is no substitute.
68 383, Street Demon 750, RPM top end,484/284/108 poo poo cam "-5 spd 4:10 SG, 4whl disk, Helwig Anti-Sway, Poly bushings,Firm Feel Box, HD Linkage, 1" t-bars, 7 leafs Springs

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road chicken
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Post by road chicken » Fri Oct 07, 2005 1:29 am

Ok here it is October of 05 and I finally got the rest of the parts for the conversion. Sheesh- that only took 6 months. Don't worry I've had my pamprin so I won't be so crabby like the last post :D AND yes I had to cut the floor pan.

It took 3 days to get the conversion done in the driveway. I work solo and am kind pokey anyway.

The KIT is pretty good- almost a bolt it- but there are a few things they need to work on. Some of the tolerances are too tight and required some clearance grinding to get eveything to fit right. Not much a 16th here and there. The "Z" bar hits the bellhousing- restricting travel and doesn't allow for the pedal to come back to the top of it's travel.

That is the only real stinker. The tranny mount needs to have some holes slotted to match with the tranny mounting holes. The cross member slots needed to be widened for the same reason. Lots of little goofing around- nothing serious...... other than the Zbar issue. That can't stand- as I have about 3 inches of effective travel at the pedal. The clutch engages just as the pedal comes off the floor- NOT the way I like it- somewhere in the middle of the travel. This twindisc clutch is a beast and too hard to control with your leg extended that far.

The only other thing is the pistol grip is tilted a bit more forward than on the stock shifter. I may make some adjustments to that as it feels awkward now.

Other than that I can't wait to get it out and run it- hopefully before the snow flies and I have to tuck it away for the winter.
4th generation B bodys- there is no substitute.
68 383, Street Demon 750, RPM top end,484/284/108 poo poo cam "-5 spd 4:10 SG, 4whl disk, Helwig Anti-Sway, Poly bushings,Firm Feel Box, HD Linkage, 1" t-bars, 7 leafs Springs

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1972RM23
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Post by 1972RM23 » Fri Oct 07, 2005 2:20 pm

Well ....I really looking forward to seeing your 5-speed convesion next year at the John Quaden Dodge show ...assuming it's done.
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road chicken
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Post by road chicken » Fri Oct 07, 2005 11:41 pm

HOPE!?!?!? arrgh :lol:

I can't figure out why the z bar would hit like that. of course the car came with a 10.5" housing and the keisler unit can handle the 10.5 or 11 inch clutch ( 130 or 143 tooth flywheels respectively). That is where I think the stink comes in as I don't think the 11" clutch was ever offered on the E/B body frame configuation. If so maybe I can talk Keisler into coughing up with the Hydralic Clutch set up and I won't charge them for installation or R&D. The only other option I can see is grinding the bell housing for clearance. That I am sure they won't want to have get out there.

We'll see.
4th generation B bodys- there is no substitute.
68 383, Street Demon 750, RPM top end,484/284/108 poo poo cam "-5 spd 4:10 SG, 4whl disk, Helwig Anti-Sway, Poly bushings,Firm Feel Box, HD Linkage, 1" t-bars, 7 leafs Springs

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road chicken
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Found te problem- well most of it

Post by road chicken » Thu Oct 13, 2005 6:14 pm

Well after going over the install in my head I finally figured out what went wrong with the z-bar.
The problem came in with the outer ballstud mount for the Z-bar. Specifically I used a washer on each side of the ballstud to keep from gouging the frame mount. That 3/32-1/8" made the difference. I took the inner washer out and got most all of what I needed. The Z-bar still rubbs on the housing- but I can attribute that to production tolerances. A quick couple of passes with a carbide burr should take the 1/32 or so out of the housing to effect completely free movement.
Yes I did call and explain to Keisler it was my fault and apologized. It just wasn't a problem with the 130 tooth housing.
Anyway- Time to go play- just in time to put it away.
4th generation B bodys- there is no substitute.
68 383, Street Demon 750, RPM top end,484/284/108 poo poo cam "-5 spd 4:10 SG, 4whl disk, Helwig Anti-Sway, Poly bushings,Firm Feel Box, HD Linkage, 1" t-bars, 7 leafs Springs

CtownRunner
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Glad it worked out

Post by CtownRunner » Thu Oct 13, 2005 7:49 pm

Good to hear of the success. I have a 727 in my 71 but my brother has a Keisler in his 70 440+6.

If my brother can do it I know it's poss for anyone to do it. Haveing driven the old 4 spd and the new Keisler unit I can tell you it's like a different car. He got the hydraulic unit but does not have it in yet. THAT should really make it a joy to drive.

CtownChris

Jaffy and Grey are really good guys. We usually park my brother's car at the Keilser display at the Nats.

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road chicken
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FInally

Post by road chicken » Fri Jun 02, 2006 2:39 am

YEEE HAAA, I like the 5 speed. I finally got it out today and started breaking in the Keisler. What a difference from the 4 speed. :shock:
The first thing I noticed was the "whine of 1st gear is gone. I kinda missed that- until I got to driving it some. With the 4 speed there was always slipping the clutch to get the car rolling ( 3.23's and 27" diameter tires). Now Pop and drop and Its moving. That 3.27 first gear gives it the "feel" of a 3.91 rear chuck. I had to put it away as i needed to get back to packing for the impending move of the household. However- right about bed time- I could just here it calling me. So after figuring I needed to knock the dust off from sitting, I took it out to the interstate- you know, to dry it off 8)
As luck would have it, as I'm entering the "on ramp" Sammy Hagar- I can't drive 55 ( or 65 for that matter) comes through the speakers. DAMN BREAK IN PERIOD!!! I had to turn it off since it takes little provocation to knock my better judgement right out the window. ( I gotta grow up ... one of these days :D ) ANYWAY That shift into 5th was the opening of a whole different world. Cruising at 75 with the engine loping along at 2200 rpm. Thats a drop of 8-900 rpm. It's also right at the "bottom" of the cam, so no down shifting for hills. I was worried about it bogging , but it just cruised along at 1400 rpm at 45 mph.
Ok , I figured after all my bitching and whining, I have to give Keisler Kudos for this transmission. It is a little clunky on the shifts, but I expect that will disappear as it breaks in. Plus the shift gate is much tighter than the hurst.

If anyone is thinking about this change- BIG thumbs up from me. It is a bit pricey- but with fuel prices, it should make it pay for itself , not to mention the wear and tear saved on the engine.
4th generation B bodys- there is no substitute.
68 383, Street Demon 750, RPM top end,484/284/108 poo poo cam "-5 spd 4:10 SG, 4whl disk, Helwig Anti-Sway, Poly bushings,Firm Feel Box, HD Linkage, 1" t-bars, 7 leafs Springs

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1972RM23
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Post by 1972RM23 » Fri Jun 02, 2006 10:49 pm

Excellent to hear it all worked out ... will you be a the John Quaden show on Sunday with your RR?
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road chicken
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Post by road chicken » Fri Jun 02, 2006 11:48 pm

Yupper. What are the "hours". And what time are you gonna be there?
4th generation B bodys- there is no substitute.
68 383, Street Demon 750, RPM top end,484/284/108 poo poo cam "-5 spd 4:10 SG, 4whl disk, Helwig Anti-Sway, Poly bushings,Firm Feel Box, HD Linkage, 1" t-bars, 7 leafs Springs

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1972RM23
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Post by 1972RM23 » Sat Jun 03, 2006 1:39 pm

It says 8:30 - 2:00 PM.
I will be there about 9 AM until 12:30 or so ...then I got to leave to help my Father with his AC.
Here is the WMMC site.
http://home.wi.rr.com/dndrodshop/wmmc/index.htm
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road chicken
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Post by road chicken » Sat Jun 03, 2006 3:48 pm

I think I'll be there about 10 am then I have to fly about the same time. Moving is so MUCH FUN!!!!
4th generation B bodys- there is no substitute.
68 383, Street Demon 750, RPM top end,484/284/108 poo poo cam "-5 spd 4:10 SG, 4whl disk, Helwig Anti-Sway, Poly bushings,Firm Feel Box, HD Linkage, 1" t-bars, 7 leafs Springs

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1972RM23
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Post by 1972RM23 » Sat Jun 03, 2006 8:42 pm

road chicken wrote:I think I'll be there about 10 am then I have to fly about the same time. Moving is so MUCH FUN!!!!
SWEET! See you there buddy!
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CtownRunner
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Keisler 5 spd

Post by CtownRunner » Mon Jun 05, 2006 6:29 am

RoadChicken,

I knew you'd love it once in. Like I said, my Brothers 70 440+6 RR is a new car with the Kiesler 5 spd. More fun and comfortable to drive.

Chris

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road chicken
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Re: Keisler 5 speed conversion

Post by road chicken » Wed Dec 28, 2011 2:02 pm

Well it was fun.... after the break in period, I found a few serious problems. First though, Hello everyone, back after a couple of years hiatus from the board. Hope he everyone is having a great holiday season.

Ok, F'in. 5spd.....

After the break in period I went to lay into it a little bit. Bad bad news on the 1-2 shift. Anything over 2000 rpm resulted in a rabid coffee grinder. Not happy, so I ran it out to 1000 miles with no improvement and decieded to park it for the winter and come back to it in spring. Fired it up, next spring and the shifter is locked up. Ok, now I'm boardering on LIVID. Went throught some basics to no avail. Just parked it and walked away for two years, I was that pissed.
So I finally pulled it out of storage and dropped the TKO500 out the beginning of Dec. The shifter was easy enough, the linkage rusted together. Now why Keisler didn't spend the 5 cents worth of anti-seize to prevent this, I will never know, but it's fixed. When I open the trans up and look inside I can see the synchro and 2nd gear have and issue. Break the trans down and found the 2ndsynchro gear end play to be way over spec. Well I might as well order up new synchro and gear. Install them and measure, same problem. There is 0.023"play end play on second gear and spec is0.000" to 0.016" . No wonder the gear is grinding. So not real happy at the moment we shall see how this plays out. I hope all I need to do is make a custom thrust washer to take up the slack. Anyway it's been a whole lote more exciting than I wanted and that is why you haven't seen me out and about. I did find the factory sunroof I was looking for though.
4th generation B bodys- there is no substitute.
68 383, Street Demon 750, RPM top end,484/284/108 poo poo cam "-5 spd 4:10 SG, 4whl disk, Helwig Anti-Sway, Poly bushings,Firm Feel Box, HD Linkage, 1" t-bars, 7 leafs Springs

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Re: Keisler 5 speed conversion

Post by ILUV72RRs » Wed Dec 28, 2011 3:58 pm

Gee, if you thought you've had fun dialing in your transmission. Just wait till you start dialing in the sun roof to work right! Out of curiousity. Where did you get the factory sun roof?

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