Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

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csilko
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by csilko » Tue Jul 28, 2015 1:13 pm

71bird wrote:Call Dixie restoration parts to get the starter, and alt mans name, and number. How do you plan on having the bottom blasted without turning the body up on it's side? At that point, I think I'd take the K frame off, and put it on a rotisserie to do that. And on the sand blast part, make sure they know what their doing cause it's real easy to ruin the sheet metal if they don't know. And what ever, take it to somebody that is familiar with these cars, and not somebody that only does Chivys.
Well, it is a very reputable restoration place that suggested the poor mans blasting of the bottom and engine compartment. http://www.impatientcreations.com/index.html. I think they know what they are doing. Most other opinions I got seem to agree that it would be a good starting point and economical alternative to a full rotisserie. Although one friend was pretty adamant about stripping it to the frame and dipping it in acid.

I had a long discussion with my engine guy as well. He strongly thinks we should go with a new carb, intake, and possible heads, for better performance, efficiency, and lighter weight. He also thinks we just go with a new starter, distributor, alternator, etc. I guess I am confused with all the options. I would like to keep it original, as I assume it was pretty fast back in the day, but if it is much cheaper to replace versus rebuild a part, then I would assume take that route, as I am not pursuing a purist project here. He was saying that to rebuild the heads might be upwards of $1000 alone. Not sure what new ones would cost, but he seemed to think new heads were a better option. Really, if I went with his suggestions, the only original things would be the block and crankshaft. Again, I am not trying to optimize performance or originality, I guess I am just trying to optimize cost at this point.

Thanks for the thoughts.

72Rdrnner
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by 72Rdrnner » Fri Aug 07, 2015 6:06 pm

Been away for a while...just saw this thread.

I too have a '72 Road Runner GTX, which I bought new and have owned it ever since, which means I have all the original parts. When I restored it I upgraded some stuff but kept the original parts.

I'll go back through the posts and see if there's anything I can help out with.
Last edited by 72Rdrnner on Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

71bird
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by 71bird » Fri Aug 07, 2015 6:34 pm

I'm not impressed at all with take shop. Cutting all of the sheet metal off of a unibody car without putting it on a jig is not the way to go, that is unless you want the body cocked eyed. If you acid dip it, you almost can never get all of the acid out of the buck, and crannies, and the last thing you want is acid under new paint. You really need to make up your mind about the keeping it original or not thing. All of your original stuff can be restored.
Go to a car show, and look at all of the different cars, and see which ones catch your eye, modified ones, or the ones that look like they just came off the show room floor, or as close as a person can afford to make it.
71 Road Runner - J68

csilko
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by csilko » Mon Aug 10, 2015 11:35 pm

71bird wrote:I'm not impressed at all with take shop. Cutting all of the sheet metal off of a unibody car without putting it on a jig is not the way to go, that is unless you want the body cocked eyed. If you acid dip it, you almost can never get all of the acid out of the buck, and crannies, and the last thing you want is acid under new paint. You really need to make up your mind about the keeping it original or not thing. All of your original stuff can be restored.
Go to a car show, and look at all of the different cars, and see which ones catch your eye, modified ones, or the ones that look like they just came off the show room floor, or as close as a person can afford to make it.
Hmm, I am not sure what you are saying here. My understanding was that I would not be stripping it down to the frame or cutting any sheet metal off, aside from the outer body work to be done after it is up and running. This restoration company, one of the largest and well known in the metro area, is basically going to put it up, take the tires off, and media blast the bottom and engine compartment and give it a good inspection for any serious frame rust (and presumably fix any issues), and then paint the bottom epoxy black and the engine compartment original red. From there, I have a clean, rust-free starting point to add new brakes, fuel, and suspension work, and eventually the engine.

As far as keeping it original, I am not going to shoot for keeping it all original. I think we are going to go with new heads and a new carb, but try to keep the original intake, and what ever other parts can be reused. If it is cheaper to go with a new distributor, starter and coil, then i would presume take that route. Unless rebuilding the old stuff saves me some money, I will go new on the ancillary parts and just keep the original stuff boxed up.

Thanks for the inputs.

72Rdrnner
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by 72Rdrnner » Tue Aug 11, 2015 10:53 am

Some advice from one who has "been there, done that, got the tee shirt"!

When I restored my Road Runner, I took a similar approach.

It was bone stock and I knew it since I was the only owner.

That being said, I also wanted to make it a little better. So I added a Comp cam kit (lifters, rockers, pushrods) , Edlebrock manifold, Holley Avenger carb, Mopar igniont (MSD 6AL) and converted the A/C to a Sanden rotary compressor and R134. Did a lot of powder coating too. K member, suspension, drive shaft, rear end, springs, and other bits & pieces. Also put a Keisler 4 speed overdrive transmission in place of the stock 727 3 speed.

The body was rust free and sound so just fixed the 3 years of dents & dings and put a base/clear coat paint job on it.

The stock wheels came off in '73 and I still had the US Mags so just cleaned 'em up and put 'em back on. Got new Goodyear Eagle radial tires rather than the old stock bias ones.

Just in case I ever wanted to go back to "bone stock" I kept every single part I took off that was original.

Ended up with what I wanted, a real head turner, but one that was more modern and better than original.

This fall I'm putting in some sort of fuel injection system. Either port or throttle body, haven't decided.

In the final analysis, what you have is YOUR car. YOU do it YOUR way. That was the mantra I started with and still follow. If someone else want's to do something else, fine. If they don't like what and how I did mine, fine...I say "get your own then".

Have fun with what is a rare bird. Took me 3 years to do the job, and other than the engine machine work, it was all done by me and a buddy in my garage. Wasted a lot of paint and drank a lot of beer, but had one helluva good time doing it.
Last edited by 72Rdrnner on Mon Sep 18, 2017 1:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

csilko
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by csilko » Tue Sep 01, 2015 9:03 pm

So my uncle's old house finally sold, 4 years after his death. One thing I forgot to mention was that in the early 1980s, he purchased a 727 Torqueflight transmission to put in his roadrunner instead of the 4-speed. When my cousin packaged everything up, he obviously put the original 4-speed in the car before we shipped it to me, so the "new" never used Torqueflight is sitting up there in NYC. I just got off the phone with the new owner of the house, and he said that in the coming weeks, unless we want the transmission, he is going to just put it out on the street to be thrown out.

I don't plan on using it in this Roadrunner, as I would like to stick with the original 4-speed, but does anyone have any thoughts on this? Is it worth getting it shipped to me, for several hundred dollars, I presume, just to have as a backup or for a future car project? Although it was never installed, I assume that after 30 years of sitting around and being moved between 4 different homes, it would need to be rebuilt (although it was actually kept indoors, in various living rooms and bedrooms over the years). Are these things worth much to hold on to? Would the cost of rebuilding it outweigh the cost of just buying a new one if I ever came across another project car without a transmission?

Thanks.

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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by sdweatherman » Tue Sep 01, 2015 10:56 pm

I am betting that there has got to be a Roadrunner Nest member that lives close enough to the old house to go pick it up and send you a few dollars for it. Someone has got to find a use for it. Start a new thread like "Cheap transmission in NYC - you just need to pick it up" so that it catches everyone's attention.
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by 72gy8 » Fri Dec 18, 2015 6:24 am

I bought a 72 gtx from Birmingham area in August of this year. I am from Cullman and know a lot of people in the area that have mopars and parts. My email is jason@excel-contracting.com, I would like to look at your car sometime.

csilko
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by csilko » Fri Dec 18, 2015 4:30 pm

Great. I will send you an email. Always looking for more contacts in the local area.

csilko
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by csilko » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:06 am

Hey just wanted to post a quick update. I have a friend who owns a restoration shop and I am going to have them do the blasting, body work, and paint. I will probably have them do the engine also later on. Given the rust on the firewall and hearing some stories about old wires, I decided to strip it down to the frame and hopefully do it the "right way" and replace the wiring harness etc. I am knee deep with it now and have removed the rest of the brake/fuel lines, bumpers, grill, etc. I am also pretty well along removing the interior trim, console and am about to take the dash out.

I removed most of the air grabber parts but I am having trouble getting the nuts off the studs in the air grabber. About half of them have spun/stripped out on the plastic air grabber side of the stud while the nut stays frozen on the bottom side even after sitting in PB Blaster for several minutes. Hopefully I can just fill and retap the plastic holes when it comes time to replace this. But I want to get it all stripped down for the blasting/painting.

So, hopefully I am a few dozen work hours away from getting it sent off for blasting and body work. Any other pitfalls I should be on the lookout for while stripping the interior and as much of the body as I can? I am going to leave the suspension adn steering wheel on it to get it to the shop and then probably just let them do the suspension bearings/bushings for me while they are getting it ready to sandblast.
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71bird
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by 71bird » Mon Sep 18, 2017 2:08 pm

Do not let them replace the suspension before they blast it, or you will have to replace it all over again. The grit and fine particles will get in to every thing and ruin it after it starts to moving around while driving. Really, if they are ok with blasting it after putting new parts on, I personally wouldn't use them. On the airgrabber studs, where they go into the fiberglass, that is a special thread, and I don't think that you would find a tap to do it. I had the same thing, so what I would suggest is that if the glass broke I would build it back up and drill the political hole and see if the stud will self tap, or I would try to build it back up, and drill a little bit bigger hole, then epoxy the stud in. All of that hardware is available new now. All of the air grabber stuff is molded fiberglass, and it's 40+ years old, so be careful. Let us know what's happing.
71 Road Runner - J68

csilko
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by csilko » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:44 pm

I guess in reading the way I posted that, it might sound like they would sand blast it after doing the suspension. It was just one of the last things we discussed, but they of course are not going to do things out of order like that. I was thinking that they could just remove the suspension and work the bushings, etc. and with the suspension off they could sandblast the rest of the car - basically the frame only. Since I am going to have it all the way to the frame, I guess I should consider the rotisserie option? Any thoughts on the pros/cons to that?

Thanks for the tip on the air grabber. I got the air grabber hood off today, and only 2 or 3 of the studs remained in the fiberglass (referred to in Alabama as "plastic" LOL). Most of the studs stuck in the hood came out with a grab from the pliers, but two of them were extremely stubborn and made it a few turns before totally locking up. It seemed like the nuts were cross threaded and it was a pain in the ass getting them out; I finally had to drill both of them out.

It looks like he had a few relatively minor gashed in the fiberglass from years of using the top of the car as a tool/junk storage and sorting location. I suppose fiberglass imperfections can be patched and repaired?

I'll be working the dash and interior more when I get back from this work trip next week. Until then.
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71bird
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by 71bird » Mon Sep 18, 2017 11:53 pm

I'm a little confused, when you say blast the frame, what are you referring to, cause there isn't a "frame" the whole body is the frame. Or are you talking about blasting the frame rails only? Really a rotisserie is the best option if it is stripped all the way down already. That way they can work the bottom so much easer, and see what they are doing.
71 Road Runner - J68

csilko
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by csilko » Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:54 am

I'm probably just not using the right terms, but I left off with the shop that I would strip the car down as much as possible to save on labor, and then wheel it on down to them with nothing more than the wheels, suspension, and steering box still attached to the frame/unibody. From there, they would blast the entire thing - interior, exterior, bottom frame, suspension, etc. Kind of a poor mans rotisserie to save a little money. They would then fix the body and frame rust, and paint the bottom with bedliner or POR or something and paint the rest in primer for the time being until I saved up for final paint.

I was going to do the suspension bushings my self after all this was done, but they got to talking about how I might just let them do the suspension since it would involve cutting torches, presses and some other tools that I might not have. For a few hours more of labor, it seemed to make sense to let them do that so when I got the car back, I could jump right into the electrical harness, brakes, fuel system, and reassemble the interior. Haven't even begun to work out details on the drive train yet.

Basically, I envisioned sending them the car looking something like this (pic I found online):
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csilko
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Re: Inherited 1972 Roadrunner/GTX 440

Post by csilko » Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:06 am

But since we're here discussing options, I guess I could strip the suspension off and try to do it myself to save money. But the suspension parts would still need to be sent off to be blasted/cleaned and then either painted, or powder coated, or whatever, right? What all would it entail to replace all the bushings and such on this thing? Right now, I don't have any kind of plasma cutter, or a press, or even a shop crane (I assume necessary to lift the rear end). I don't even have 220V in my shop for a cutter, but I have priced out the inexpensive press at Harbor Freight ($100) and the shop crane ($170 or so). But the only suspension experience I have is replacing the leaf springs and shackles on my utility trailer. Suspension is more uncharted territory for me, but I guess every bolt and every interior screw so far has been uncharted territory for me, so what the heck.

If I strip it all the way down to nothing but the unibody, I would need to basically attach some car moving wheels to be able to transport it around, right? Looks like those go for $400 online, unless I can fashion some on my own or find some used or something. I wonder how much money I would save pulling the suspension off vs the extra costs of buying the necessary tools that I don't have.

Thanks for the insights.

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